False prophets and the need for skepticism

[modernmystic]

I'll start with the disclaimer that I am a bona fide skeptic, in that I want to know the truth more than I want to doubt others as a means to feel righteous... thus I am ever skeptical of my own skepticism. Still with me? OK. That said, I am skeptical of those who make a living proclaiming things that even the keenest mystics have a hard time verifying. I have run the gamut of channeled materials and prophecies, and a lot of it seems to amount to people saying "listen to your intuition and you will know that I am right," when the truth is, their stories often contradict one another.

I am speaking from experience here. I've personally bought into various predictions and paradigms which turned out to be bogus under closer scrutiny, and I was duped through a psychological device in which I mistook a feeling of upliftment for spiritual insight. The message was something that part of me wanted to believe, and when my hopes and expectations were affirmed, what I actually experienced was a surge of righteous conviction masquerading as intuition.

On subjects like cataclysmic earth changes, archangels, or dimensional shifts, I have just read too many contradictory proclamations with that "your intuition will confirm this" hook. It has taken a lot of reflection for me to not end up jaded to the whole enterprise, but I seem to have arrived at a middle path. On one hand, I recognize that humankind has an incredible potential, and believe that there have been many bona fide visionaries throughout history. On this basis, I don't disregard things like the Hopi prophecies, Edgar Cayce's predictions or the Hindu notion of "cosmic breaths" just because I haven't confirmed every detail for myself. On the other hand, I recognize that some people who claim to possess a superior spiritual understanding are really selling Snake Oil!

Let's not forget that the New Age movement began to be very profitable in the 1980s, and for some it has become a racket. Even those who started out with some real vision and insight can fall victim to a regressive slide into demagoguery. The litmus test, for me, is that a person continues to emphasize accessible truths--ways that people can live more rich and fulfilling lives in the here-and-now. The narratives which I find most authentic are the ones where any predictions or transcendental cosmologies are interwoven with keen observations about living a more vibrant and meaningful life. The other key feature is an ability to illuminate goings-on in the broader world in a tangible context, rather than framing everything in lofty transcendental terms. When a mystical thinker has a lot to offer in this regard, I tend to be much more open to their intuitions about broader matters that I have not been able to personally verify. (For the record, in all of the above criteria, James Redfield is the best of 'em. :wink: )

I don't want to be a "downer" or push anyone too far in the direction of skepticism, so let me just say that intuition is an amazing thing, and we can all use this innate gift to corroborate much that is outside of our reason. I just wanted to caution people against the temptation to escape doubts and fears about the future by buying into the first message that fits what we wanted to hear. This sets us up for a dynamic of "false intuition" which actually shuts the door to the real thing, by superimposing a mental construct over a whole area of the truth.
_________________
Handbook for the Modern Mystic is a free online resource for people who are exploring beyond the five-sensory model of human existence. Read on at www.modernmystic.com

[starsapphire]

I very much appreciated your post. Every great teacher is always the student first and learns very well to be a skeptic and also learns to question everything. The Middle Path is neither to the left nor to the right but in the middle where reason exists. The soul needs to travel both the left and the right to gain experience and understanding. As far as contradictions? Amen to that, it's enough to drive me crazy. However, no two people in this world have the exact same perspective even if they shared the exact same experience? We may share some compatibilities in our views but never completely the same. It would be a boring world if we did:) We need to have the conflict and the friction in order to grow as humans. Your on the right Path alright and teaching seems to be your forte this time around:)
Starsapphire

[Sushanta]

@ modernmystic
great!
but seems like no one cares about your words
shame on that forum--where has scepticism disappeared to??

time to wake up mayan believers!

my "12insight" for 2012:

mayan calendar
a big lie causes big illusion
there is no mayan tradition, no historic context that justifies this whole story about 2012

mr.calleman
false prophet with a big ego

james redfield
a good prophet has lost his way.
celestine is perfect - why you went into that "marriage" with
calleman???
if you do not already, you'll might regret these ways as a big mistake, james...

CULTIVATE CRITICISM/SCEPTICISM against these Mayan stories,
people in US!
COME BACK to the HEREandNOW, James Redfield!
No Mayan Calendar will solve your problems over there,
will not keep your politicians from heading into the next war.
Nothing will change if we are not working for change and future
NOW
instead of waiting for MAYAN ILLUSIONS to come!

[starsapphire]

All correct from the belief system and perspective you carry within you today:) A friend of mine traveled to Peru and visited some of the Mayan Elders and even they will tell you today that the prophecies given at that time were "not incorrect" but also that prophecies and predictions are only as accurate as the energy "at the time they were given". The future is altered by the consciousness of mankind. Al evolved souls will tell you that your demonstration is far more important because that will predict your future. There are many, many probable realities and we know so little about this but it certainly might be feasible that when this planet transitions itself into this higher frequency that each one will go to the reality that they have evolved too or is compatible with, no different than when one departs from what we call a physical death that the same applies. And James is correct because "We" as individuals and as a whole are responsible for making these changes here in the Now. And, it is also correct that one should never follow blindly or be obedient to any one person but question for yourself what is your truth or what isn't for you.

[Sushanta]

just philosophy.
facts?
mayan calendar came to mayan elders - they did not come with it cause they never heard about it in their history.
cause there is no long term calendar tradition in maya culture.
for sure none relating to a certain day in 2012!
the poor people down there were lucky to jump on that mayan calendar train being invented by mr. calleman -
cause they benefit from that -
as well as mr. calleman.

[starsapphire]

[quote="Sushanta"]
just philosophy.
facts?
mayan calendar came to mayan elders - they did not come with it cause they never heard about it in their history.
cause there is no long term calendar tradition in maya culture.
for sure none relating to a certain day in 2012!
the poor people down there were lucky to jump on that mayan calendar train being invented by mr. calleman -
cause they benefit from that -
as well as mr. calleman.[/quote

I'm not familiar with Mr. Calleman but aside from the Mayans their are other cultures and prophecies who have also made reference and or confirmations to the 2012 demarcation point in man's evolution. This, to me, is about the Planet's evolution. We can research this planet's evolution through millions of years and see all the changes that have taken place and we don't need a calendar to do this? Does this mean that I think December 21, 2012 will be a climatic change in the earth? Not necessarily but there is always that probability? It could be then it could be later, no one knows for sure. Time in Space and Our time is quite different. On the big scale it's irrelevant because we're here in the physical because our lessons are here in this reality, this dimension not the next.

[Sushanta]

yes, our lessons are happening in the here-and-now and not while waiting for a mayan calendar to come on us.
I dont know about any traditions in other cultures relating to 2012 - they all have followed that "trend 2012" - as well as mayan elders.
But:
Wasnt it Calleman who said last winter it has changed to 2011??
I would have expected James Redfield to be the one that understands,
that this mayan myth is used as a big projection of millions on earth being deeply frustrated that there is not realy a change for good in worldwide perspective and that they in their lifetimes will have to live with that --
just look at the news everyday---
you see a big transition on earth???
After 2013 the mayan dreams will vanish to nothing.
And many will regret to been walking in that trap
after being cheated by false prophets.
We have to do the job everyday and everywhere to do our best to bring that planets evolutuion further and not waiting for mayan stories to do that for us - this is the danger of that whole story.
And this bad effect when millions wake up in 2013, being more frustrated than before.

[starsapphire]

I feel strongly that James Redfield is a kind, compassionate and very intelligent individual. It's certainly not in my agenda to come to this forum or any other to sabotage any one's belief system or way of thinking. Millions believe in the 2012 change over, Millions do not? Many are hopeful, Many are fearful? Me, I'm one of the hopeful ones but if I wake up on December 22 and I'm still in this reality then so be it:) If I wake up somewhere else then I won't know the difference anyway, at least not consciously?

[Sushanta]

yes, obviously its not "in your agenda" to "sabotage" here cause you are a mayan believer --
nor its in mine!
"sabotage"---harsh words - no need for that!
is criticsm allowed here, is it welcome?? isnt it necessary to be critical in almost any parts of our lives?
i am here for good, for insight, as you might understand later, maybe in 2013 when that mayan bubble had splashed.
"belief"--thats the right word. its just a belief.
but do we create our future, do we solve these urgent problems on earth in 2012 by beliefs??

OPEN LETTER to JAMES REDFIELD
Dear James,
i agree, you are a very kind and remarkable individual in spiritual scene.
i was listening to your global prayers several times over here in germany at late night times - great experiences! i read one or two of your wonderful books, i have the movie. to me you are one of the most symphatic men in that scene, wish i could meet you one day personal.

But James, when i heard the first time about your engagement with that mayan story, i was deeply shocked and disappointed - losing confidence in yourself. i am an astrologer in germany and i do know something about calendar and time quality. 2 or 3 years ago the mayan scene got more and more arrogant and elitist saying: we can forget our western calendar, we can forget western astrology(these are also callemans words!) - we have something better now. this brought me to deeper research on that mayan story and my results are:
there is defintely no mayan tradition for a long time calendar. they did have a short time calendar and their culture in expressing time periods also - like many other ancient ones - relates to the 4 main stations on earths journey every year: longest day, shortest day and in between the 2 with equal length of day and night(which is the base for western astrology and will be that base although the star background rotates), they manifested that in their temple constructions. it is not possible to relate our calendar to mayan history in a way we could define a certain day in 2012. also the end of mayan calendar has no reliable historic background to be expressed in time-scales. .historical facts manifested in their temple buildings as 9 levels could be interpretated in that way after spiritualy walking through that 9 steps OUR EARTHLY CIRCLES OF DEATH AND REBORN will end cause we go back to the devine being. so that mayan calendar is not a calendar, it stands for spiritual evolution. what about seeing it this way?? 2012 is an interpretation of calleman and others - nothing else. an interpretation to their benefit! did you ever read a comprehensible calculation of that day in 2012?? to me calleman and others are false prophets with a strong ego as busybodies in spiritual scene. why did calleman change the end date to 2011 - any explanation for that which satisfies you?? and what does he say about that now in march 2012?? it all has moved into the astral, we might hear and in 2013 only the initiated ones will get it or something like that. and the not initiated ones like me they just missed it---okidoki~~~
maybe he changed the end-calculation because he has some good astrological advisers cause there were strong astrological movements between august 2010 till spring 2011 (the "arabic revolution") when uranus moved to aries the first time again since 84 years(strongest astrological period since----- at least 20 years)? so thats not a mayan source - its mr.calleman adapting to a real calendar of astrology with old and reliable tradition. and we will all come back to there, folks....
a spiritual leader like you, James, should understand this phenomena of mayan calendar: a projection of spiritually enganged and identified people trying to put something against this worldwide mysery which great singer
jackson browne expressed that way: " if we could see it (our earth, our lives) from a satellite with its endless beauty.... we could think its paradise.
but its turning so slow....". 2012 will pass by and nothing essential will have changed. for millions it will be an embarrassing thing to face that.
walked into the trap, again. deep-water-horizon did not cause a change - fukushima not - this worldwide financial crisis created in US did not cause consequences which ar damn urgently necessary -how deeply millions of us are daily frustrated if they open their eyes and watch that tragedies in syria, china, in our oceans, with our animals. and we sit there and wait for a mayan dream to come true - hard to take that...! it will take us years after 2013 to clear up and discuss what that mayan story being vanished to space have done with us and how to avoid such false paths in future.
are there no good astrologers around you, james, which had given good advice to you for that period in your life between dec.2010 and aug.2011 when saturn transited your birth neptun(what he does once in 29 years)?? ask them if you havnt yet! usely such a period is a strong crisis for spiritual or religious ones. i guess this was the period when you moved into that mayan thing. saturn then causes a fight between materia and belief, between faith and doubt in our spiritual conviction. it brings up false decisions from the past(maybe from previous life too) which still have energy within us. and i-m sure, james, it will take a pretty work in your future (or probably already..??) to clear up that period.
it could be seen as trying to manifest an essential part of celestine philosophies into a calendar to make it a rational thing to be seen.. somehow like this big humanity-old struggle between believers and non-beliebers: "if you believe in God than show it to me..!"but with that you have left a good way and went into a "marriage" with a person/a myth that just earns my contempt for confusing millions on earth. see that video on
>http://www.videogold.de/der-mayakalender-kommt-nach-norden-1teil/
---its in english although its a german website, see what he predicted for 2011 and 12 as a big name in mayan story , see especially in the last 15 min in part 2 what he dared to say 7 years ago --sorry, i call that crazyness! and a shame for our period in spiritual evolution and - sorry to say- a shame for celestine consciousness!
change for these urgent problems on our planet comes through the power of love , truth and wisdom and insight in the true forces that enable evolution (in celestine terms) or sabotage it.
establishing that mayan calendar is to me a sabotage. certain sentences in callemans books (which for sure i did read) turned me to getting goose bumps (if thats the right expression for my disgust..) and brought tears to my eyes seeing a remarkable man like you dear james joining that path - please accept that as my "insight" -- and i guess there will be an increasing number of people seeing that more or less the same way.
instead of waiting for mayan prophecies to come true we should go out in that endless HEREANDNOW and work and stand up against bank and atomic/nuclear power and that militaries already heading for the next war aganist iran +++++ 1000 other ugly stories.

i send all my love to you, james.
please accept criticsm here. seems i'm the only one here,
a suppressive person somehow....jesus.
please leave that post, dont delete it.
Sushanta

[Silent Watcher]

MM, you are exactly right. Paring down the issue to its core, intuition is a source transmission that moves from within; it is not something that can accurately be proven from without. Many of us make the mistake of seeking external verification of our internal perception of our source information, making the effort to take the extra step simply because we can't find it within our hearts to trust ourselves... when, in essence, trust should be strongest and clearest in oneself, and absolute in that sense over all trust in others.

It may seem I'm running directly counterpoint to the Celestine message in saying this, but on the contrary, I am referring to an aspect of the interplay involved in control dramas - control dramas on an intrapersonal level, between oneself and one's self. Before we can master our connections with others, we must first unify our awareness and our perception of the world beyond ourselves. Only then can we trust completely to our instincts, our intuition, when dealing with information coming from other sources, for only in unity of the self can we interpret information as we must for it to work the greatest good within us.
_________________
In each of us is a hollow that cannot be filled, a craving that is not quite hunger, but something more persistent, more real...

To touch divinity, one must first be prepared to brave reality.

[Sushanta]

this amount of ignorance here is just unbelievable, folks!
you mayan dreamers will wake up in 2013 and will be ashamed
of that stupid dream---.
james redfield,
to me and others you have lost a good deal of your good reputation by joining that path---
nothing that feeds that mayan bubble will bring our world further on--
its just the opposite!
spiritual leaders should be carefull with the ways they are joining -
you missed that, james.
~~~~~
i say goodbye here, no use of spending my energy on dreamers and
blind ones.....